http://chasida.blogspot.com/2007/08/real-zionists-make-aliyah.html

Is it just me, or are people not using trackbacks?

Perhaps not surprisingly, a lot of these folks tend to be Americans, who I guess bring their own expectations and standards to their new homes.

Right, this goes back to your observation that a good deal of North American olim tend to be more on the religious side, since secular Zionism is on the decline currently. Who better to attract to Yesha than Modern Orthodox Jews with a built-in expectation of a suburban ranch home?

lol, some summary! I read both. :-p

In my opinion, there are two models for Jewish living:

* you can be a literate, involved Jew in some diaspora community.

* you can live in a Jewish country (I’d consider ‘The Pale of Settlements’ to fall in this category to a degree)

Both models have flaws. I hear of more & more Israelis who leave Israel, and end up marrying non-Jews because their chiloni parents never bothered to remind them that they should marry Jewish (since it was taken for granted in Israel). But I rather live in a world where there is a choice between the two.

As for the denominations promoting Zionism: not too strange. Both Conservative & Reform Judaism have branches in the WZO. You’re very right in observing that it’s hard for them to kvetch about their unfair treatment in Israel when they have such small numbers; they have about as much political clout as the Karaites. Also, I think going back to my ‘two models’ shpiel and the goal of Taglit/Birthright, they see living in Israel as an experience that only solidifies and strengthens an individual’s Jewish identity. Whether that individual leaves after 3 years, or stays, they get a benefit. A double-mitzvah of sorts! :-p

Thanks for the correction. Just chalk it up to my own ignorance. I’m aware that most of the coast is pretty heavily developed. By the same token, I’m sure that some people that head for Israel are indeed pursuing some derivation of the pseudo-sabra dream, and it’s interesting to wonder how much of the country still identifies with the idea of Zion as wilderness (though presumably not to a great extent, given where the major population centers are). Again, I’m not saying Israel can’t do it, just that such a major population influx would obviously require a lot of changes, one of which would be increased development and density. Incidentally, I definitely agree that Israel would be well-served to continue developing places like the Negev. Of course, then we get into issues like where to get water.

I think the moshav as settlement has been going on in various forms since the late 80s, early 90s, probably in part the result of the new immigrant boost from the Soviet Union. It’s always interesting to read about people that head for Yesha not for real ideological reasons, but because they want larger homes, gardens, etc. Perhaps not surprisingly, a lot of these folks tend to be Americans, who I guess bring their own expectations and standards to their new homes.

… eh? Where does this come from?

Unless you were a ’sabra’ kibbutznik, most immigrants to Israel preferred densely-populated cities/towns, where most people lived in 3-story (or taller) apartment blocks. Remember the old stereotype of Jews being wandering cosmopolitans, with no tie to any land and an aversion to farming?

The turning of moshavim into American-style ’suburbs’ is a relatively new phenomenon from my understanding.

The settlements aren’t the only alternative, despite what the Yesha Council might try to sell you. The Galil and the Negev are in great need of “settlement”, too. I wouldn’t mind living on a moshav in the Galil…

The ‘overcrowding’ argument was used by the Arabs to reject the creation of Jewish communities in pre-state Israel. Back then, there was ~500,000 people between the river & the sea. Now, there is 9 million. I just don’t buy it.

Your second point is rock-solid. I completely agree, and it factors into my personal philosophy of modern Zionism.

1. There’s as many Jews in the U.S. as there are people in Israel — what if the population of your already crowded city/county/state suddenly doubled?

2. Having all Jews in one place would make it oh so tempting for someone like Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.